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Bamboo - the other side
Last Post 17 May 2010 11:03 PM by tommys. 31 Replies.
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gavinrUser is Offline
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17 Jan 2009 08:35 AM
    Bamboo is perhaps the one of the best renewable resources to gain popularity in the residential markets. Bamboo is rapidly renewable, extremely strong in both tension and compression and versatile in its applications and appearances.

    I have but one reservation when it comes to bamboo use in the United States and that is the major resources for bamboo are mostly in Asia or other tropical regions which require substantial amounts of shipping.

    Buying locally sources, processed and manufactured materials is very important and while bamboo has the tag of rapidly renewable resource, it is not local and therefore there is a balance of the good and bad caused by the increased use of bamboo.

    I wouldn't stop using the products from bamboo, but I always feel its important to completely explore a product and its benefits/drawbacks before purchasing and installing it.

    bob the builderUser is Offline
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    17 Jan 2009 09:05 AM
    gavinr, you are right, bamboo is not the perfect material when it comes to sustainability. It is however one of the best options around.

    There aren't many sources of bamboo in the states and none that I use. I do steer my clients toward FCS certified wood though. This is a great option. You can find many local sources and through the FSC certification process you know that the wood was sustainably harvested. While not a rapidly renewable resource, when a forest is sustainably harvested, the wood is a renewable resource.
    GHDINCUser is Offline
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    17 Jan 2009 11:32 AM
    As a home developer (standard homes not green) I haven't used bamboo much, but it is interesting. The first non-standard flooring I used was a composite flooring and I was very pleased. Bob, FSC products are great. A little more expensive for something that looks and performs the same, but I think its worth it to know you aren't contributing to the deforestation problem.

    I would say that anything is better than the old methods of using old growth hardwoods. Can't do that much anymore, but there is still a demand for some of the more rare species.
    unsureUser is Offline
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    01 Feb 2009 11:16 AM
    I can't see using bamboo. It looks cheap and flimsy. I truly like the look of exotic hardwoods. They look powerful and bold.

    I wonder if we are taking this too far though. Trees are a renewable resource. Why do we need to go that extra step to a rapidly renewing one. Are we focusing on the right things here?
    gavinrUser is Offline
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    03 Feb 2009 08:06 AM
    unsure, I understand the hesitance of many people when it comes to change and the alteration of an industry, but bamboo is just not an example of "going to far". Bamboo is a traditional building materials in many cultures and its relative newness to western construction is more a commentary on the US building industry than the usefulness of bamboo.

    Why rapidly renewable? Deforestation for one. Current practices in many parts of the world do not protect ecosystems and geographic locations from being stripped of trees and therefore biological diversity. The forests are seen as income potential rather than health benefits. A product like bamboo does not have the same problem as you don't see deforestation and in fact bamboo is not a tree at all, it is a grass.
    pthalodezinUser is Offline
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    06 Feb 2009 06:19 AM
    I do love the look and feel of bamboo as well as the good feeling I get from using a rapidly renewable resource rather than forest products. Bamboo has versatility and a great amount of strength, and in certain applications can be assemble to compete with the strength of steel. I would almost go so far as to say that this is the ultimate building material.
    gavinrUser is Offline
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    14 Apr 2009 07:33 PM
    I just wanted to push this one back up. I have been seeing a lot of the home improvement shows using more and more bamboo in many different ways. I even saw one using it as a countertop in a bathroom. It looked really warm and modern at the same time.

    It would be nice to see some more domestic production of the material now that it is gaining such popularity. If you take out the shipping component to this material, it would be that perfect material that Pd speaks of.
    recycledUser is Offline
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    15 Apr 2009 06:25 PM
    I don't see enough open crop land to be able to handle planting bamboo. My understanding is that it grows in the tropics under certain environmental conditions. I don't know if we have the land with the right soil conditions. Its a great idea, but maybe importing is the only option.
    KarenCUser is Offline
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    18 May 2009 02:11 PM
    Bamboo holds some promise as it is a quickly renewable ressource, requires no pesticides to grow and actually very strong (so great for flooring etc...). But unfortunetly I don't think it's all it's been hyped up to be. There's the transportation issue as has already been mentioned.

    But it's not the only one... There's also the issue that bamboo is a small/thin slat wood, which means that for most applications it must be glued together. Most of it is manufactured overseas, can we really be confident as to what kind of chemicals are in that glue? Bamboo is also a very aggressive crop and is sometimes problematic for farmers as it tends to spread too easily.

    Then there's the possible ethical issues relating to what kind of business practices we can expect from countries like China... Not an environmental issue per say, but still something to consider...

    Then there's the issue relating to bamboo as a fabric (not really a building material per say, but it does relate to home use in terms of linens etc...). More than 95% of bamboo fabric is made using toxic chemicals to chemically break down the fiber. It could be broken down physically (and some is) but as things are now, this is rare. Bamboo fabric also loses strenght when wet (contrary to cotton which actually gains strenght when wet), which means that it will more susceptible to wear & tear in the washing machine and may not last as long as cotton.

    Now, I'm not saying that bamboo doesn't have it's place (perhaps for those who live in areas where it grows naturally for example) but I do wish it wasn't hyped as some kind of 'perfect' building material or fiber.

    Karen.
    recycledUser is Offline
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    19 May 2009 07:38 AM
    The hype surrounding bamboo reminds me of the energy that was floating around about corn ethanol being the solution to our vehicular fuel needs. I think bamboo is a great material, but I do wonder if its the solution we should be focusing on.

    Maybe we should focus on all the possibilities in reclaimed wood.
    gavinrUser is Offline
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    20 May 2009 06:12 AM
    The glue issue is one that will be handled by market forces though. As people try to reduce VOCs in the products they use, manufacturers will cease using dangerous chemicals.

    I am not sure if all bamboo products are manufactured in China the way you are presenting. Bamboo in many cases is a raw material that is shipped and then manufactured into consumer products elsewhere. I am sure that much of that occurs in China, but maybe some of it occurs elsewhere and even in the US.
    KarenCUser is Offline
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    20 May 2009 08:19 AM
    Of course, hopefully people will start to consider such issues and push for changes. But at the moment, the glue thing is still an issue and that's all I'm saying.

    I'm not saying that all bamboo products are made in China, I know for a fact that some aren't (I use bamboo cloth diapers and they are in fact made in Canada). But for flooring and cabinet use I have spoken to someone I consider to be somewhat of a building industry expert (works for a government regulatory/surpervisory agency) and asked his opinion of bamboo as a building material. One of the points he brought up was that many of these products were indeed manufactured in China (or other Oriental countries, many of which have the same issues as China). His concern was actually mainly in what kind of quality standards one could expect from them and what kind of recourse one would (or more likely would *not*) have if there were significant defects in the product.

    Not to mention that a product would not necessarily have to be totally manufactured in China for there to be ecological or human rights issues. Just the idea of how/where/by who the bamboo is planted and harvested can be of concern. Are local environmental issues respected? Are local farmers' needs taken into account and respected?

    There are certainly perhaps bamboo products out there for which these are non-issues. But consumers will never know to search out these products unless these issues are raised and discussed.

    Karen.
    gavinrUser is Offline
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    20 May 2009 12:22 PM
    You are right to raise the issues of human rights and environmental protection in developing nations, but there should be some attention paid to not scaring off new consumers. If every time there is a glimmer of hope and a chance for a better and more ecologically minded product to come along, there are hordes of people saying, "its not perfect" "its not this and that" then how will we ever make progress.

    Sure there are some issues with bamboo, but would you rather us cut down old growth exotics from the amazon. I know the same human rights issues exist there, but lets suspend belief for just one second and say that there weren't humanitarian issues. Would you then buy the exotic wood instead.

    At some point, less bad is actually as good as its going to get. We can't have everything now and sometimes we need to take it one step at a time. Buy the bamboo floors. Find the best on the market with the highest quality and the least amount of chemical contamination. Buy the bamboo because its better then the other option.
    KarenCUser is Offline
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    21 May 2009 06:58 AM
    I guess I just don't this as being a choice between exotic wood from the Amazon and bamboo from China. If someone came to me and said they were redoing their floors and had to have an exotic look but were looking for something a little more eco-friendly I would certainly suggest bamboo over something from the Amazon. In that sense you're totally right that it is definetly the 'less bad' option and I would certainly not lecture this person on the drawbacks of bamboo. I would instead encourage them by talking about all it's good points, and it certainly does have good points.

    But if someone was looking to redo their flooring wanted a greener option and asked what I thought of bamboo then I would not encourage them towards it. I would instead talk about reclaimed wood as the best option. If that was too expensive or difficult to find I would then talk about FSC wood. And if that was also too expensive then I would encourage them to use regular hardwoods but to find a smaller store instead of the big chain suppliers. A smaller store is more likely to know their suppliers very well, to use small local mills that are in turn more likely to get their wood from local tree plantations (which, for my area at least, is 'less bad' than clearcut wood coming from virgin forests in Northern Canada or those from old-growth forests on the West Coast).

    You're right that we, as environementalists, shouldn't bombard 'green' newbies with lectures about why the latest eco product isn't 'perfect'. We should indeed encourage them towards 'less bad' products when the 'perfect' option is too extreme or just not available. My beef isn't that bamboo isn't 'perfect'. As much as I strive towards it, my life is far from perfect and there are plenty of times I settle for 'less bad' for a multitude of reasons. This isn't about a search for perfection. It's about realism and not allowing people to be fooled into thinking something is 'perfect' when it's not. We need to be vigilant about false impressions of greenness (either purposely by a company wanting to make a quick buck, or because a company/individual has genuinely bought into an overly hyped up product). This has the potential to be disastrous for the movement if it results in newbies becoming jaded and losing all interest in being eco-friendly.

    Karen.
    earth houseUser is Offline
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    21 May 2009 08:17 AM
    Is it just me, or is it getting a little hot in here. KarenC and gavinr, from what I am reading, you fight for the same team. You seem to have different perspectives on bamboo but when push comes to shove, I bet you are on the same team. You do bring up a good topic though.... Greenwashing. Its virulent in today's marketing and advertising, everyone must be green to sell their products. But rather than hijacking gavinr's thread here, maybe we should step outside and start a topic elsewhere to discuss greenwashing.
    KarenCUser is Offline
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    21 May 2009 04:43 PM
    Must be just you, not hot in my neck of the woods! ;-) Just a friendly discussion... I actually thought I was just expanding on Gavinr's initial point so I'm postive we're on the same side...

    I don't know that anyone hijacked anyone's thread, gavinr was just making a valid point about how we can influence people with our attitudes and that we should make sure to not be overly negative with our critiquing new products or ideas. I just joined in with my view on the matter.

    In regards to bamboo specifically I wonder if it's greenwashing or just the media that latched on to bamboo as the 'cool new green product of the year'. I have issues with how the media covers 'general interest' topics like environmentalism, health care etc... But then that really would be hijacking this thread....

    Karen.
    bob the builderUser is Offline
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    23 May 2009 04:08 AM
    Bamboo needs our attention as a viable option in going green, but I agree that steering people toward reclaimed woods and FSC certified woods is actually a more sustainable approach. That said, once the home building industry recovers and demand once again begins to rise, the need for wood will outstrip the capacity of both reclaimed and FSC woods. Bamboo therefore needs to play a strong role in filling the gap, as do engineered woods and other products.
    luvstreesUser is Offline
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    25 May 2009 08:07 AM
    I agree, its not really greenwashing as much as it over hyping bamboo. Its a better product than many of the flooring choices out there. I think its a versatile product but I would say that people should be hesitant to ever use a product based solely on what advertisers and other media sources are saying. Do your own research and find the right product for you.
    gavinrUser is Offline
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    21 Jul 2009 02:30 PM
    As a wood flooring material, what would be better. FSC certified woods might be comparable but those types of trees take much much longer to reach maturity and the amount of embodied energy is so much higher. To cut down a large tree is much more harmful than harvesting a hardy grass. Sure there are longer shipping channels, but I think its a wash.
    carlUser is Offline
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    28 Jul 2009 10:11 PM
    Does anyone have a comparative graphic or calculation showing the energy inputs and outputs for bamboo versus fsc wood. I would love to see how much energy is saved through bamboo harvesting and usage compared to sustainably forested woods and if that amount exceeds the energy needed to ship the bamboo from tropical regions.
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